More untruths?

1

The text of Obama's speech today:

I’m the only candidate who doesn’t take money from corporate PACs and lobbyists, and I’m here to tell you that you can count on me to stand up for you after this election, just as I’ve been standing up for workers all my life.

Then there's this from Newsday:
Last fall, Barack Obama quietly slipped into the Miami headquarters of a major law firm scarred by the scandals of Jack Abramoff, its once-powerful Washington lobbyist who now sits in jail.

Arriving a little after 10 a.m. on Oct. 1, Obama spent the next three hours schmoozing, speaking in a video conference to branch offices and raising money at Greenberg Traurig, a billion-dollar firm with one of the biggest lobby shops here.

Obama has now raised about $125,000 from Greenberg Traurig employees -- nearly half of it at the time of the event -- more than from any of the other top law and lobby firms.


To be the very most charitable about it, Obama may be able to say that his comments are technically accurate. However:
"It's kind of a distinction without a difference," Krumholz said. "As an industry geared for hire, both lawyers and lobbyists represent a special arena of influence in Washington."

Not all lawyers who influence government or advise others how to do it register as federal lobbyists, she said. And lawyers and partners in firms that also lobby benefit from the profits of lobbying work, and the access for their firm.


Krumholz is with the Center for Responsive Politics. To me, this is an example of Obama splitting the gnat's eyelash, working to get campaign money from lawyers at law firms that have stables of registered lobbyists on their payrolls. Then there's more from factcheck.org:
Clinton and Obama are slamming each other and the oil companies in dueling radio ads in Pennsylvania. Both ads exaggerate and twist the facts. Both ads say, in effect, that the opposing candidate is reluctant to offend oil companies due to campaign donations. The truth is they both propose energy plans that are similar, and which the oil giants won't like.

● Obama's ad claims, "Clinton's taken more from big oil and other PACs and lobbyists than any other candidate, Democrat or Republican." Actually, Clinton is fourth and Obama is a close fifth when it comes to donations from oil and gas industries.

● Clinton's ad says that "she's the one who will make oil companies pay" to support her clean-energy initiatives. In fact, both candidates propose to spend $150 billion for energy improvements over 10 years, and both propose to pay for some part of that through higher taxes on oil companies.

● Obama's ad says it is he who is "demanding higher gas mileage standards." Actually, both candidates voted for last year's increase in those standards and both candidates propose further increases in the future. Clinton's proposed increase is a bit higher than Obama's, in fact.

● Clinton faults Obama for voting for the 2005 energy bill, which she calls "the Bush Cheney energy bill." But the compromise Obama voted for was supported by most Senate Democrats and lacked many of the administration's original proposals. As we've said before, it resulted in a small net tax increase on oil companies.

● Obama's ad talks of "gas prices close to four dollars a gallon" in Pennsylvania. Actually, the statewide average for a gallon of regular gasoline is $3.32, according to the American Automobile Association.


And then there are the flip flops.

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Dear Mr. Words Mean Something: I'm disappointed.

(#89888)

I was expecting proof that Obama accepted PAC or lobbyist money. Instead, according to your sources he only accepted money from people who work for a firm that also does lobbying work. Which isn't, unless words don't mean what they mean, the same thing. Heck, every American who works for a national corporation is in the same boat if they want to donate to a campaign.

Should Obama only be accepting money from the unemployed?

Sincerely,
A Concerned Reader

I'm disappointed that you're disappointed

(#89895)

Question marks also mean something, hence the inclusion of one in the title. Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't I say that his comments were technically accurate?


"I think BDog would make this place interesting." --catchy

You've set my mind at ease: the question mark, of course!

(#89898)

The question mark represents a wish, not amazement, which was my first impression. You're *asking* for, *hoping* for evidence that Obama has been untruthful about lobbyist money, in spite of the unfortunate fact that all evidence points the other way — No harm in asking, though!

Jordan: Five-time lottery winner?
Dirt: The new cheap energy?
Heather Graham: Blogger fetishist?
Iraq: Libertarian paradise?
Monkeys: Flying out rear end?
Beer: Lifetime supply?
CNN: News for adults?

Thanks, I think I've got the hang of it now.

What it represents

(#89907)

The point was that Obama's statements were technically accurate but that he was making distinctions without real differences. The question mark was intended to denote an open question. Also open to question is whether you "got the hang of it now", but at least it was entertaining. ;)


"I think BDog would make this place interesting." --catchy

Republicans: party of racist, sexist idiots?

(#89903)

http://polwatchers.typepad.com/pol_watchers/2008/04/republicans-tal.html

U.S. Rep. Geoff Davis, a Hebron Republican, compared Obama and his message for change similar to a "snake oil salesman."

He said in his remarks at the GOP dinner that he also recently participated in a "highly classified, national security simulation" with Obama.

"I'm going to tell you something: That boy's finger does not need to be on the button," Davis said. "He could not make a decision in that simulation that related to a nuclear threat to this country."

As for Obama's Democratic rival, McConnell said U.S. Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton of New York seems to be "teetering on the brink."

"I hear she hasn't been this worried since a new Hooters opened" near her home with former President Bill Clinton, McConnell said, prompting laughs from the 400 Northern Kentucky Republicans.

No word on whether the "boy" remark was a laugh line, but apparently no one got up and left, which would seem to have been indicated.

Oh, I forgot the "idiots" part.

"The people we're fighting against now are worse than Adolf Hitler and Nazis. And we don't know where they live, half of them," Bunning said.

The Nazis weren't as bad, see, because we knew where they lived. Hitler's mistake was raising an eighteen-million-soldier Wehrmacht and thereby revealing his position. Osama bin Laden will not be repeating this error.

The other day I heard that ignorance and apathy are sweeping the country. I didn't know that, but I don't really care.

I hope Obama is lying about this

(#89887)

http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/03/29/837657.aspx

Barack Obama promised that his foreign policy would be a return to what he says was the realist approach practiced by George H.W. Bush and Ronald Reagan.

"My foreign policy is actually a return to the traditional realistic policy of George Bush's father, of John F. Kennedy, of in some ways Ronald Reagan," he said Friday.

Yes, a return to the glory days of Vietnam, the Bay of Pigs and Iran-Contra. Just what we need.

This is by way of a broad hint, BD, that if you want me to seriously reconsider voting for Obama, it's not going to be because some law firm gave him $125k.

The other day I heard that ignorance and apathy are sweeping the country. I didn't know that, but I don't really care.

Is There A Way To Divide Up These Diaries?

(#89886)

One for Redstate, one for us. At least in that way we can cut the crap in half.

“Two clichés make us laugh but a hundred clichés move us, because we sense dimly that the clichés are talking among themselves, celebrating a reunion." - Umberto Eco

You are in a tizzy over $125,000?

(#89867)

Get some perspective man.

"And now you run in search of the Jedi. They are all dead, save one. And one broken Jedi cannot stop the darkness that is to come." -Darth Sion

Tizzy?

(#89872)

This isn't about $125,000, this is about the words that come out of Obama's mouth. Obama had quite a take at Greenberg Traurig because it means that at least 54 gave him money ($2,300/person maximum) from there. I will say that this post is smaller beer than the previous ones.


"I think BDog would make this place interesting." --catchy

The technically true words that come out of his mouth?

(#89875)

Obama doesn't take money from registered lobbyists or PACs. That is a fact. Is there a list of almost registered lobbyists that he shouldn't take money from? Is there a list of Corporate employees that he shouldn't take money from? What would make you happy?

I have actually had business dealings with Greenberg Traurig and my business has nothing to do with politics. GT is a HUGE law firm with 1,750 lawyers in 29 locations around the world. If you're truly worried about what 55 of GT's employees did then you are looking for things over which to be outraged.

"And now you run in search of the Jedi. They are all dead, save one. And one broken Jedi cannot stop the darkness that is to come." -Darth Sion

Your "technically true" stuff sounds like WRC.

(#89882)

Is that really the image BO is trying to project; the old "depends on what the meaning of "is" is"? Not my impression of the guy at all.

So none of this nuance, please; it's not a question of what makes BD happy (a pie in BO's face might do that) but whether BO is trying to mislead voters. And his statement was deceptive any way you put it. If you know big lawfirms you know they almost always have a lobbying practice, whether they officially announce it or not. IIRC, last election cycle some law firms were charged with law violating campaign spending limits by filtering contributions through employees, a very rudimentary and obvious way around limits on the amount the law firm itself could contribute. I recall that the firms in question were big-buck but obscure plaintiffs' PI shops giving money to Kerry/Edwards.

I'm sure you also know law firms and lawyers are usually the biggest single bloc of contributors. Unless you believe we all are kindhearted and generous to a fault, you can assume that mooney is buying something. So pretending that 55 employees spontaneously gave $125K to BO in return for nothing is either naive or disingenuous.

Politicians spend our money like a pimp with only a week to live.  CJ Boxx

Obama told the truth

(#89885)

BD and you apparently, want to pretend Greenberg Traurig is a lobbying shop. It isn't. It is one of the biggest law firms in the country and the biggest in Miami. If you have evidence that Obama is colluding with Greenberg Traurig or any other law firm to bypass election laws then please present it. Otherwise you are just offering up innuendo as fact.

The fact is Obama doesn't take money from PAC's or registerd lobbyists. Nothing you or BD have written has disproved that fact.

Also, $125,000 is chump change. If you want to spin conspiracy theories then please use some realistic numbers. Do you really think Obama is dumb enough to be bought off with $125,000?

"And now you run in search of the Jedi. They are all dead, save one. And one broken Jedi cannot stop the darkness that is to come." -Darth Sion

You seem to think that being a large law firm means no lobbying

(#89892)

when just the opposite is true. And you want to treat $125K as chump change. OK, fine, so long as you know that violating campaign spending laws is a question of what, not how much. "Large" and "generous" rarely applies to law firms, who are looking for influence in return for contributions. Like I said, this is true regardless of size; many plaintiffs' PI firms are small in terms of # of attorneys, but give huge contributions to people like WJC, Kerry and Edwards in return for staunch opposition to tort reform. But you already know that, I bet.

The demand for "evidence of collusion" and the claim that suspicions are just innuendo is a huge double standard I'll be reminding you of in the near future if you comment about the other candidates' fundraising. Surely you've watched politics long enough to know that there rarely, if ever, is proof of deals in that arena. Do you think that Dick Cheney pushed the Iraq war to benefit Halliburton/KBR? If so, what is your proof? Did Bush pay off Big Pharma with the Prescription Drug Bill, or Big Ag with his stance on immigration reform? You and I both know he did, but where's the proof?

Insisting on proof of influence-peddling before you will consider that as even a possibility is political naivete, like I said above.

Politicians spend our money like a pimp with only a week to live.  CJ Boxx

Obama must work cheap

(#90027)

As I said above GT is a HUGE law firm. According to the link in the diary, employees of that HUGE law firm have contributed $125,000 to Obama, $63,000 at one event in Miami. You and BD seem to want to assume this means Obama is now in the pocket of GT. You want us to believe that GT has purchased influence with the Obama campaign based on these numbers. I think that is just plain silly.

If you want to claim GT is buying influence then show me the money. If Obama can be bought off for $63,000 then you are assuming he is either an idiot or a greedy bastard.

"And now you run in search of the Jedi. They are all dead, save one. And one broken Jedi cannot stop the darkness that is to come." -Darth Sion

What the hey?

(#89845)

Obama says Bush is a usurper:

I know that Al Gore was mentioned earlier. By the way, I have to say, I think Al Gore won. And...

[APPLAUSE]

I'm not even sure what to say about that. I guess my first response is "So what have you done about it?"

Of course, we live in an age of bombshell revelations that are greeted with yawns -- Bush just admitted that he "discussed and approved" specific CIA torture techniques, including waterboarding. But we'll have to wait until he really shocks the conscience by having extramarital oral sex before we can impeach him.

The other day I heard that ignorance and apathy are sweeping the country. I didn't know that, but I don't really care.

I kinda thought he...

(#89857)

...ran for Senator and then for President, and consistently voted and advocated for measures which would make the repeat of the Bush/Gore scenario much less likely.

It's impossible to debate if people simply hold beliefs that have no grounding in reality.

He didn't actually vote much, at least in his career's

(#89893)

early stages. IIRC,he set some kind of record for voting "present" in the Illinois legislature.

Politicians spend our money like a pimp with only a week to live.  CJ Boxx

Sure

(#89871)

And it's more than I've done, but still, if you really believe the President of the United States is illegitimate...

Bush should have been impeached long ago*. I've come to terms with the fact that he won't be, but I'm still not sure why, and I think at least part of the explanation devolves from a lack of Democratic leadership.

*Not because of 2000. But if I did think he stole the election, I'd definitely want him impeached for it.

The other day I heard that ignorance and apathy are sweeping the country. I didn't know that, but I don't really care.

There is an intermediate thought,

(#89874)

which is that the system as currently designed is not robust enough to appropriately decide close races, so while Gore may have "won" in 2000, it's better to shore up the system first than try to fight against a guy who did (after all) get an awful lot of votes.

It's impossible to debate if people simply hold beliefs that have no grounding in reality.

"So what have you done about it?"

(#89853)

He did nothing, just like the rest of the country.

But unlike the rest of the country

(#89856)

he happens to be a sitting Senator. One could argue that gives him a little more responsibility in these matters.

The other day I heard that ignorance and apathy are sweeping the country. I didn't know that, but I don't really care.

Jeez

(#89838)

I'm beginning to miss your Lancet diaries!

Just how many of these are we going to see this week?

This place is my vacation.

More importantly, Gabriel

(#89842)

I wonder how many are goping to be devoted to exposing and criticising any inconsistencies in Sen. McCain's rhetoric vs. reality?

Right.

To Be Fair

(#89843)

there's nothing wrong with partisanship. There's no reason for Bird Dog to do other people's homework.

Nothing wrong with partisanship.

(#89861)

Nothing wrong with selling cars or vacuum cleaners either. Except when you try to hustle the same people over & over again.

That's my only point

(#89868)

I have no problem with BD attacking Dems. Heck, he should be commended for posting diaries which is what keeps this place alive. But basically the same diary over and over and over again in just a few days?

This place is my vacation.

I like to think of BD as a dedicated Obamologist. nt

(#89869)

.

The other day I heard that ignorance and apathy are sweeping the country. I didn't know that, but I don't really care.

I Doubt There are Enough

(#89839)

gnat's eyelashes to split for these to be daily features, but Bird Dog's inventiveness continues to impress.

Obama also visited Google

(#89836)

and is receiving most of those employees' financial support. Google, of course, joined the lobbying game headfirst in 2006. Damn that Obama for taking lobbying Google money.

Every organization in the US...

(#89835)

...of any size has lobbyists on staff, and they all have employees.

By definition, if Obama takes any nontrivial amount of money at all, this diary would be technically accurate.

It's impossible to debate if people simply hold beliefs that have no grounding in reality.

To be the very most charitable about it,

(#89837)

Bird Dog may be able to say that his comments are technically accurate. To me, this is an example of Bird Dog splitting the gnat's eyelash.