Mitt Romney Has Money Problems

HankP's picture

No, not the kind of money problem you or I might have. It's unlikely that he'll ever come up short at the end of the month. But he does have problems with two aspects of his wealth: his lifestyle and his financial arrangements. In the hands of a more skillful politician these wouldn't be serious problems, but in Romney's case he's been so tone deaf that they're starting to hurt him.

 

The first problem Romney faces is his well known extravagant lifestyle. There's nothing wrong with being wealthy, but in American society it's considered somewhat déclassé to flaunt it unless one wants to wind up like the freak show Donald Trump has become. It's certainly a drawback for a politician running for office. I can't recall ever seeing a successful politician who ran on the concept that he's richer than most people and therefore knows better. Every politician runs as a "man of the people" with varying levels of success. Romney was born into wealth and increased it substantially during his career. But that career, buying and selling companies for millions and even billions of dollars, is not something the average person can sympathize with or even envision.

 

There's nothing inherently upper class about being an equestrian, I live in horse country and plenty of non-1%ers have horses. They even engage in dressage. But they generally don't get $70K tax deduction (technically a passive loss carryover) for doing so. There's nothing wrong with having a large house, even a large vacation house. But having a car elevator is pushing it, and actually hiring a lobbyist to push for changes in local zoning laws is way beyond what Democrats could even hope to make up. The fact that he's engaging in this type of behavior while running for President (something he's been working on for at least the past six years) implies a kind of tone deafness that is really extraordinary for an American politician. As Michael Gerson points out,

 

Romney’s wealth is not ill-gotten. His problem is political. He talks about money as though engaged in a discussion with his stockbroker. So $374,000 from paid speeches is “not very much.” He is “not concerned about the very poor,” on the assumption that the safety net is enough for them. His wife “drives a couple of Cadillacs.” While not a racing enthusiast himself, Romney has “some great friends that are NAS­CAR team owners.”

 

All of these individually wouldn't matter that much, but taken together it paints a picture of someone who lives a lifestyle far beyond average (and even many wealthy) Americans. That's a problem for someone running for President at a time when the poor and middle class are told they have to sacrifice things like affordable health care and a secure retirement. By itself it's not insurmountable, but it is a drag on the campaign. It also doesn't help that Romney's tax plan (such as it is) will increase taxes on the middle class and lower then for the wealthy even if using highly unlikely assumptions in evaluating it.

 

Next we get to the heart of the matter, Romney's financial arrangements. These stem from the fact that he was born wealthy and increased his wealth substantially during his tenure at Bain Capital, a firm he co-founded. Bain engaged in several actions that while legal are political poison, including asset stripping, raiding of pension plans and loading up acquired companies with debt.

 

First things first, let's get rid of the idea that Bain (or any other company) functions as "job creators". Companies only add jobs when they have to. if they found a way to operate a company with a single employee while making their profitability goals they certainly would do so. Any job creation that occurs is despite, rather than because of, the owners requirements for financial return on the assets invested. Even Mitt Romney admits this. Bain was no different, and often quite a bit more ruthless, than other ownership groups in these areas. In fact, they pioneered the use of increasing leverage at purchased companies to guarantee a healthy return to themselves. Most people, when hearing about Bain's business practices, are very surprised to hear that Bain ensured it's initial return on an investment whether the company succeeded or not. It's another example of the "heads I win, tails you lose" attitude of Wall Street and does not play well with most voters in the fallout from the continuing financial crisis.

 

There are several symptoms of the kind of wealth Romney became accustomed to, the key political issue arising from this is his refusal to release more then 2 years worth of his tax returns (and incomplete release at that). It's already clear that he used offshore accounts, and while there's no proof of tax avoidance that's by far the main reason such accounts are used. There was a recent report that Italy still considers some of the transactions he made when acquiring Italian companies questionable at best. And there's the very unusual issue of having tens of millions of dollars in one's 401K account (which are limited to annual contributions in the $5K - 50K range).All of these are conditions exclusively engaged in by the very wealthy, and while I'm sure Romney was scrupulously careful to make sure that they were all legal they still stink. They stink even more when coupled with a financial reform plan that seeks to reduce the taxes of the wealthy and increase it on the poor and middle class.

 

The tax returns really are a millstone around Romney's neck. Every time the issue is brought up, Romney and the Republicans are forced to play defense. You really don't want to be in a situation where two words completely disrupts your campaign, and can continue doing so right up to the election.It's the first sign in a long time that the Democrats haven't completely forgotten how to play hard ball politics, and it seems to enrage Republicans. That's a big advantage since people tend to make more mistakes when they're emotional about a subject. More and more Republicans are asking Romney to release his returns, they can see where this is heading and they don't like it.

 

Expect to hear a lot more about these issues in the fall because, no matter what some on the right say, how one acquires a fortune and how it is handled are very legitimate political questions.

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Not really

(#285794)
Bird Dog's picture

Kerry had similar money "problems" and Dems defended him to the hilt. It comes across as more than a little hypocritical that Romney is dinged for being in similar financial straits.

Two, Harry Reid's ploy will backfire. Even liberal Democrats like Cohen and mainstream media like Schieffer are having trouble stomaching his hyperpartisan tactics, and even the White House is distancing itself.

So it's wishful thinking, Hank. You guys nominated a billionaire by marriage eight years ago, so any discussion of how rich and detached Romney is rings hollow and smells of political posturing.

 

Government is merely a servant – merely a temporary servant; it cannot be its prerogative to determine what is right and what is wrong, and decide who is a patriot and who isn’t. Its function is to obey orders, not originate them.

I think you're making my point

(#285799)
HankP's picture

How'd that work out for Kerry?

I blame it all on the Internet

Not really

(#285803)
Bird Dog's picture

All Romney has to do is point out your party's hypocrisy in defending an effete billionaire.

 

Government is merely a servant – merely a temporary servant; it cannot be its prerogative to determine what is right and what is wrong, and decide who is a patriot and who isn’t. Its function is to obey orders, not originate them.

Effete?

(#285805)

Seriously?

They couldn't hit an elephant at this dist...
-- General John B. Sedgwick, 1864

They miss Agnew nt

(#285812)
HankP's picture

.

I blame it all on the Internet

Once again, how'd that work out for Kerry? nt

(#285808)
HankP's picture

.

I blame it all on the Internet

Kerry's wealth was only beginning of his many...

(#285823)
Bird Dog's picture

...problems as a candidate. This is just a Bright Shiny Distraction diary. Nothing more.

 

Government is merely a servant – merely a temporary servant; it cannot be its prerogative to determine what is right and what is wrong, and decide who is a patriot and who isn’t. Its function is to obey orders, not originate them.

Hardly the case.

(#285825)

The Romney story has legs.

 

But, even if it were just a Bright Shiny Distraction diary, let the record show that bright shiny distractions are effective on primates, and have been used systematically by the GOP since Nixon. If you don't believe me, spend a night in Vegas.

 

So it's a big shiny problem for the Romster. Like Hank, I am finding it quite plausible that he is simply oblivious to it.

I am not a pessimist. I am an incompetent optimist.

Like I said,

(#285878)
Bird Dog's picture

wishful thinking. I think you and Hank are listening to too many of your own liberal kind, especially in light of Reid's full-blown credibility-shredding hackery.

 

Government is merely a servant – merely a temporary servant; it cannot be its prerogative to determine what is right and what is wrong, and decide who is a patriot and who isn’t. Its function is to obey orders, not originate them.

Nobody cares about Reid

(#285887)

Certainly not regular people who don't follow politics on a daily basis.

 

But people do know what it means to get Bained. Everybody at this point has been, or knows somebody who has been, in a company that went through the Bain treatment. Romney is the very face of that, and to my surprise the democrats have decided to call him on it.

I am not a pessimist. I am an incompetent optimist.

More wishful thinking

(#285900)
Bird Dog's picture

He's the most powerful elected Democrat after Obama. He makes a perfect whipping boy for all that's wrong in DC. Right now, he is personifying gross Beltway hackery at its lowest gutter level. If they were smart, the GOP should do a Willie Horton on Reid and make him look like Obama's running mate.

 

Government is merely a servant – merely a temporary servant; it cannot be its prerogative to determine what is right and what is wrong, and decide who is a patriot and who isn’t. Its function is to obey orders, not originate them.

I smell desperation nt

(#285904)
HankP's picture

.

I blame it all on the Internet

Ha!

(#286013)
Bird Dog's picture

Responding to a diarist's wishful thinking = desperation! Nailed it! Hi-larious.

 

Government is merely a servant – merely a temporary servant; it cannot be its prerogative to determine what is right and what is wrong, and decide who is a patriot and who isn’t. Its function is to obey orders, not originate them.

No wishful thinking here

(#286028)
HankP's picture

Wagster already posted the polls. I'm not the one reversing my previous position on "words mean something" by inventing new definitions suitable to this occasion, I'm not the one who's descended to name calling in lieu of valid arguments, and most of all I'm not the one frantically spinning and trying to make this about a non-provable comment by Harry Reid as opposed to the mortal blow to the Romney campaign that it is quickly becoming.

 

I'm just enjoying the show.

I blame it all on the Internet

The tax evasion stories won't

(#285910)

The tax evasion stories won't sway you or me to vote a different way, that's for sure.  What are the chances it will sway a disaffected independent or undecided voter?  They are smart enough to know that all Romney has to do is release his tax records and the story will die.  He hasn't, it looks really bad.  

Unfortunately for your thesis

(#285841)
HankP's picture

it's just the beginning of Romney's problems as well. "I'm rich and I want to cut taxes for rich people" lacks a certain appeal. As is his cluelessness of how normal people behave and speak.

I blame it all on the Internet

Did Bush II run on cutting taxes for the wealthy in '00?

(#285864)

My recollection is that the tax cuts were rolled out after the election, but perhaps other people have better memories.

Much different situation

(#285867)
HankP's picture

remember, at the time we were looking at fiscal surpluses. Tax cuts aren't contentious in that kind of environment, even though Bush's numbers didn't add up.

I blame it all on the Internet

Heh, bring it on

(#285810)

Looking forward to the Terraza Heinz Kerry v Antoinette Romney cage match.

"Something I think most liberals don't understand is exactly how stupid many conservative leaders are." - Matt Yglesias

Well

(#285800)

You guys made fun of Kerry for his rich-guy elitist windsurfing ways, so I guess no one can point fingers. http://www.livingroomcandidate.org/commercials/2004/windsurfing

They couldn't hit an elephant at this dist...
-- General John B. Sedgwick, 1864

The WH distancing itself

(#285802)

I think they planned to do that all along in order to stay above the fray.

 

But Pelosi backed Reid's play today, so there's enough high profile Dems calling out Romney to keep this in the news.

 

I'd guess the plan coming from the top is to add D governors and other D Senators as needed to keep the story in the papers.

Yup, drip, drip, drip

(#285809)
HankP's picture

they can keep this up for months.

I blame it all on the Internet

About Three, I'd Say

(#285822)
M Scott Eiland's picture

And after that, for at least eight years.

The universe may well have been created without a point--that doesn't imply that we can't give it one.

Is it time for predictions already?

(#285840)
HankP's picture

because based on past predictions, I'm really waiting for this one.

I blame it all on the Internet

Trouble is...

(#285820)

Kerry wasn't running on a platform of cutting his own taxes.

 

White House distancing itself? C'mon, BD. You're not that naive. As long as the words "Romney" and "Taxes" are being bandied about in close proximity to each other, they are as pleased as punch.

"I don't want us to descend into a nation of bloggers." - Steve Jobs

Hot Damn! The Romney Tax Cheat Evidence Starts Rolling In...!

(#285811)

 

Mitt and Ann Romney were easily able to afford a $12-million La Jolla home.

But that didn't insulate them from the winds buffeting the real estate market in the months following their purchase in 2008.

After paying cash for the Mediterranean-style house with 61 feet of beach frontage, they asked San Diego County for dramatic property tax relief.

Romney, the presumptive GOP nominee for president whose wealth is estimated at $250 million, has rejected calls from Democrats and Republicans to release his income tax returns prior to 2010. But San Diego County assessor records shed light on one sliver of the couple's personal taxes during that time: a months-long effort to reduce their annual property tax bill.

Initially, the Romneys asked that their 2009 assessment, $12.24 million, be reduced to $6.8 million, maintaining that their home had lost about 45% of its value in the first seven months they owned it.

Thirteen months later, after hiring an attorney to guide them, the Romneys filed an amended appeal, contending the home had suffered a less-dramatic fall of 27.3%, to $8.9 million.

They also filed an appeal for the 2010 tax year, claiming the house had dropped further, to $7.5 million, 38.7% less than the home's assessed value.

As a result, the Romneys have saved about $109,000 in property taxes over four years.

 

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-romney-property-tax-20120806,0,4926772.story?dssReturn

 

Lovely, call yourself a smart businessman, buy a home for 12M, six months later, claim that you lost 6 million of value....lol

 

Mittens is a joke.

 

Lastly, the San Diego Assessor valued the residence in the final analysis at 11.4 Million

 

On Feb. 23, 2011, the board reduced the 2009 assessment by $800,000, to $11.4 million,

 

Cheaters getting caught cheating!!!!!!!!!!

 

This is so much fun.

 

Best Wishes, Traveller 

 

 

 

So. . .

(#285839)
M Scott Eiland's picture

. . .making a legal argument using established procedures and in accordance with legal advice is "cheating"? Your Brethren in the California State Bar will be annoyed with you, my friend.*

*--I let my membership lapse a while back, so it's not my problem any more.

The universe may well have been created without a point--that doesn't imply that we can't give it one.

Yeah.

(#285842)

Just more aggressive tax avoidance.

It would be unamerican to do otherwise.

Not so fast there

(#285846)
HankP's picture

it's unclear that a claim of a 45% decrease in value is legal or if it's attempted fraud. Just because claims like that aren't prosecuted doesn't make them legal.

 

Like most of Romney's tax avoidance strategies, it stinks. Keep putting these in the paper and his negatives will keep going up.

I blame it all on the Internet

More BSD

(#285879)
Bird Dog's picture

It's a scandal! Romney is appealing a tax assessment! How dare he! 

Government is merely a servant – merely a temporary servant; it cannot be its prerogative to determine what is right and what is wrong, and decide who is a patriot and who isn’t. Its function is to obey orders, not originate them.

The Sale Number is...(duh) Presumptively the Correct Appraised

(#285884)

 

...value number for property tax purposes, in this instance 12.24M, not the argued for 6.8M.

 

The San Diego County Assessor came up with the correct number, or one at least arguably correct after the appeal of 11.4M.

 

But can't you see how stupid, beyond the blatant & fraudulent tax cheating,  how stupid this makes the Mittser look...He paid 12.24M for a house only worth 6.8M....He done got cheated!

 

LOL

 

Or, more accurately, he just wanted to cheat us.

 

What is coming to seem to be standard for Mr. Romney.

 

Gads, you guz's picked a looser and I don't particularly like Obama...but the Mittster? Hahahahahahahahahahahah....

 

Best Wishes, Traveller 

BD, you know better as a professional

(#285891)
HankP's picture

market price decreased 45% in seven months after a sale? Give me a break.

I blame it all on the Internet

More BSD

(#285895)
Bird Dog's picture

The $6.8 million in the initial appeal is irrelevant. All parties know that. The relevant number is the one brought to a Board of Equalization hearing. I do this for a living, Hank, and I have an 80% success rate. This is a big wad of Left-Wing Dry Hump.

EDIT: I can't speak for the San Diego area, but in my neck of the woods, county BOEs side with the assessor 90% of the time. We get our results at the state level. The county assessor has an advantage because they are presumed correct, even if they're not. The appellant has to provide sufficient evidence to overcome the presumption.

 

 

Government is merely a servant – merely a temporary servant; it cannot be its prerogative to determine what is right and what is wrong, and decide who is a patriot and who isn’t. Its function is to obey orders, not originate them.

It's not irrelevant

(#285896)
HankP's picture

it's part of a pattern with Romney. Politically it looks awful if you're always trying to pull a fast one, especially with the numbers involved.

 

You can call it whatever you want, but it looks like another rich guy who's always trying to game the system.

I blame it all on the Internet

I don't exactly know house appraisal law very well

(#285890)
brutusettu's picture

I'm guessing the county tries to get the high end market value for the property.

 

is the appraisal cost the price the property would sell at the lowest asking price during that year?

is there any smoothing on this property value? I'd have a hard time buying the Romney would take a nearly 50% lost to flip a property virtually as fast as he possibly could.

 

 

Is it legal to ask for an appraisal price that would be far-far-far below what a property owner would be willing to sell it if they wanted to a fair market value out of it?  Even though this appraisal litigation doesn't exist in a vacuum and is coming from a tax filer that tries to cut their taxes because of some dancing horse provision of some sort etc etc etc,  I just don't know the county codes of San Diego.

"I’m to believe that North Korea is so dangerously unhinged that they would attack without warning – yet so meek and easily cowed that they will sit quietly and not retaliate when we start bombing them."

Major Kong

Property tax appraisals are based on fair market price

(#285894)
HankP's picture

the gold standard is what the property sold for in the last sale transaction, after that the property value is adjusted using a formula that looks at the change in valuation of comparable properties. In this case the sale price in 2008 set the fair market price. It's virtually impossible for a property to drop 45% in value in seven months absent the discovery of nuclear waste or an ancient Indian burial ground.

I blame it all on the Internet

Perhaps

(#286176)
stinerman's picture

Future Mrs. Stinerman had a contract for her house fall through because of appraised value.  The county appraised it 7 months ago at X and the bank's appraiser said it was worth 90% of X, mostly beacuse there are no comparable homes in the area (its in the middle of nowhere).

 

So 10%, not 45%, but it's still a hell of a drop.  Even money says that when the county reassesses, it'll go up from X.

The Constitution does not vest in Congress the authority to protect society from every bad act that might befall it. -- Clarence Thomas

Just going to cherry pick one thing here

(#285833)

"First things first, let's get rid of the idea that Bain (or any other company) functions as "job creators". Companies only add jobs when they have to. if they found a way to operate a company with a single employee while making their profitability goals they certainly would do so. Any job creation that occurs is despite, rather than because of, the owners requirements for financial return on the assets invested."

 

Not a very fair remark - the exact same point could be made about infrastructure spending.  When you build a bridge you don't (or shouldn't) hire people just to have them standing around in dayglo,  and you don't (or shouldn't) hand out needless contracts just to get the money spent.  Nevertheless people get hired and money gets circulated and that's thought to be a good thing.  

 

Likewise spinoffs from the manned space program.  If something can be bought off-the-shelf,  it is. Any research that occurs is despite, rather than because of, the need to get the stuff launched. Nevertheless, the research gets done.

 

On the rest of it, I agree that Romney's lifestyle is way out there even by rich guy standards, and that'll cost him.  But really no major politician's lifestyle would bear close examination by anyone with an egalitarian mindset.   Even those from lower middle class backgrounds use their power and influence to get away with all kinds of stuff, and enjoy all kinds of privileges,  that ordinary people can't.

Fair Point

(#285837)

But the argument for infrastructure spending holds even without the direct job impact. Without decent infrastructure, you get a banana republic.

 

On the other hand, the argument for lower taxes on the rich kind of falls apart if you peel off the "job creators" euphemism.

I am not a pessimist. I am an incompetent optimist.

It's one thing to be rich

(#285838)
HankP's picture

it's another thing to repeatedly remind people that you're rich. I don't think Romney does it on purpose, it's just that he's pretty clueless as to how he comes across. What's beneficial in the boardroom doesn't always play well in politics.

 

BTW, your cherry picking stopped just short of Romney admitting that he wasn't a job creator, which was kind of the point.

I blame it all on the Internet

Romney is a terrible

(#285848)

Romney is a terrible politician, that is the bottom line.  In this political climate with unemployment and anger at elites dominating the news cycle, a populist is the way to go.  Romney can't do "populist" for about 100 reasons but his temperament is number one. His vast wealth, tax problems, former career, and wife's hobbies are probably next on the list.  At least Kerry had the sense and ability to do "populist".  Plus he had fought the "man" at some time in his life, though that was used against him to famous effect.

He did get elected Governor in Mass

(#285861)
HankP's picture

although that seems like an entirely different Romney at this point. I think the main problem is that he's trying to thread a needle that doesn't exist - how to appeal to the current Republican party and the public at large at the same time.

I blame it all on the Internet

Well, he couldn't do either

(#285863)

Well, he couldn't do either very well if he only had to choose one.  That says alot about how bad of a candidate he is.

Romney symbolizes everything wrong with the country...

(#285854)

he *is* the financial crisis incarnate. And yet, at the same time, his conservative bonafides suck, he was for socialism before he was against it, he's not a real Christian conservative, and he's got the charisma of a wet sandwich. And by the way, he's the most dishonest politician of our time.

 

It's uncanny, almost as if Republicans set out to pick the worst possible candidate they could find.

M Aurelius was probably right.

Not really

(#285860)
HankP's picture

compared to Bachmann, Cain, Gingrich, Perry and Santorum he probably was the best choice available.

 

Now why they were the choices in the first place is the more interesting question.

I blame it all on the Internet

Yes but none of those incompetents

(#285907)

would figure as a Marvel Comics supervillain personification of the 2008 financial crisis. 

M Aurelius was probably right.

Imagine if this were John Kerry in 2004

(#286020)

Conservative-controlled media would have everyone laughing about Kerry's horse tax deductions for months before deciding for everyone that he must be fundamentally shifty and lack character/conviction not to release his tax returns and let the chips fall where they may. 

Conservatives are mean to the news media

(#286081)

.. and they are organized. Maybe democrats need to get similarly organized and take their cue from Harry Reid and get mean. I'm sure every news organization in the country would be unindated with 'viewer' complaints about the lack of attention to the story, if this where say, Barack Obama refusing to release his tax returns or explain his extensive investments in offshore accounts.

"Something I think most liberals don't understand is exactly how stupid many conservative leaders are." - Matt Yglesias